What is the solution? What is the answer? How can so many people engage in meaningless blabber without a single coherent suggestions as to what a solution would look like?
Apartheid has been the reality for decades, and the ethnic cleansing for the past two months. Unfortunately, it will ultimately end (even more) badly for the Palestinians, since Israel will never allow a two-state outcome. And the entire world will be powerless to do anything about it as long as the United States continues its slavishly "unshakable" and morally bankrupt support.
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Is it ignorance or are you spreading misinformation? When Israel left Gaza in 2006, it imposed a blockade around it. Israel made it an open air prison. Nobody can get in and nobody can get out without permission from Israel. Even those who need to seek medical treatment in other countries like cancer patients, are more often denied. Gaza does not have an airport. Nobody can just board a plane and go anywhere. Imported items are also strictly controlled. At one point, Israel measured the amount of food that can go in that is just above starvation level. Chocolates are forbidden.
Are you kidding -- or just stupid? They imposed a blockade because Hamas is a homicidal, maniacal terror organization that kills innocent people and in its charter states that their objective is the destruction of the State of Israel and immediately made their intentions known by launching thousands of missiles at Israel. Had they wanted to turn over a new leaf and acted in a civilized, peaceful manner, Israel would have gladly taken down any blockade. BTW...it's not just Israel. Egypt has an even tighter blockade. Israel issued work permits for people living in Gaza (many of whom became spies for Hamas for the October 7 massacre). Egypt won't even do that knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood radical Islam offshoot does no good no matter where they live.
When you enslave and subjugate people and give them no hope, prepare for consequences. Never in the history of mankind where slavery did not revolt. Those Hamas terrorists who burst from the gates of their prison were in their early 20’s. They were born into the concentration camp Israel created. Even dogs, no matter how docile they were as puppies, but if you chain them, beat and abuse them everyday of their lives, they are going to be vicious.
It is Hamas that has kept its people in this situation. If they wanted to live in peace, they certainly could. They instead choose to live in a state of war. Again...think about what Gaza and its people could have been had they chosen to invest the $2 billion in making Palestine a great place to live -- with education and technology jobs, resorts on the Mediterranean, and more. Blame Hamas. Blame Hamas. Blame Hamas.
A slave or anyone a victim of an apartheid state can always choose to live in peace. But they are still a slave and oppressed. Maybe by your standard it's ok to be a slave.
Apologists for occupation love to cite the fact that Israel finally left the land it had taken by force in 1967, in violation of international law. These apologists also conveniently forget to mention that Israel still maintained total control of Gaza's land border, coastline, and airspace, in effect creating what has been called the world's largest open-air prison. Israel allowed the inmates to run their own jail.
As far as elections, the people had a stellar choice between the corrupt, bloated Palestinian Authority and Hamas. These elections, by the way, were held at the insistence of the US.
Regardless of the inept, selfish way Hamas has ruled, this has absolutely nothing to do with the substance of my previous post. This misrule does not explain the apartheid system that has existed in Israel WAY before the election of Hamas in 2006. And it has even less to do with the cutting off food, water, electricity, and fuel to a captive civilian population, and the murderous, indiscriminate bombing campaign that Israel has launched against the people of Gaza. This was my point. Not the failures of Hamas to turn Gaza into a Mediterranean resort, which would still have been impossible due to the Israeli blockade.
Israel will surely degrade Hamas' military capability, but it will never destroy Hamas. As far as this utopian future you posit where Gazans elect a new government to "live in peace," maybe you haven't noticed that Israel is systematically laying waste to the entire Gaza Strip, and has already killed 20,000 innocent civilians--not Hamas terrorists. There will be nothing left when all this is over--just an uninhabitable wasteland and two million more homeless refugees.
It took Hamas about 5 minutes to show their intentions after gaining control of Gaza (their charter to destroy Israel was already known, of course) -- when they began launching missiles at Israel. Why would Israel (or Egypt) open their borders with a homicidal terrorist organization that has already stated their intentions to murder Jews? What country in the world would ever do that? Hamas could have governed for the people, but instead operated only for themselves with their intention to kill.
As for the current operation, after the savagery that Hamas murdered, raped, and burned alive people, and the following days reiterated that this will continue again and again until they succeed in killing all Jews and destroying Israel, you're damn right that Israel is going to do everything they can to destroy them first. While I don't for a second believe the Hamas fatality numbers, I know that if Israel didn't care about civilian lives, the numbers would be dramatically higher (i.e., see nearly every other war in history).
My bet is once the war is over and Gaza demilitarized, a comprehensive plan will be proposed that will include an interim international force consisting of Egypt, Jordan, the Saudis and several other countries governing and overseeing the rebuilding of Gaza and paving the way for a two-state solution with Israel that includes normalization with the Saudis, et.al.
But, first things first: Hamas leaders and military complex must be destroyed.
"Until they succeed in killing all Jews and destroying Israel." Are you serious? Do you really think that the most powerful military in the Middle East (Israel), armed to the teeth with American weapons and a nuclear arsenal, could possibly be wiped out by Hamas? You're obviously buying into the Netanyahu lie that Hamas is an existential threat to Israel. Nothing could be more ridiculous.
And clearly Israel doesn't care about civilian lives. It has cut off food, water, electricity, and fuel to 2.3 million people. It has dropped 2,000-lb bombs on apartment buildings, schools, UN shelters, grain mills, mosques, etc.
And your "bet" that after the war is over there will be a "comprehensive plan... paving the way for a two-state solution" is firmly rooted in delusion. There will never be a Palestinian state. Gaza will be completely destroyed, and Israel will not lift a finger to rebuild it. And the West Bank is riddled with illegal Israeli settlements consisting of walled-in ghettos of impoverished Palestinians. The Israelis will never evacuate 700,000 settlers. So please tell me where this "state" will be situated.
If "the most powerful military in the Middle East" wanted to use its military might and not care about civilian casualties, all of Gaza would be laid to waste in a matter of hours. It's only because they are a humane military that they are instead as methodical as they are -- warning civilians to vacate target areas, going house by house in dangerous hand to hand combat, etc. Hamas must be eradicated to give the Palestinians a chance for peace.
As for water, there is no sign that Gazans are running out of water or food. But to take a step back, think about what Hamas has done with $2 billion of aid. Did they build desalinization plants, install drip irrigation, develep water treatment stations? No, they built terror tunnels and weapons. They took pipes that Israel had installed to deliver water and turned them into missiles.
Just as Dresden/Germany and Hiroshima and Nagasaki/Japan came back from devastating bombing campaigns that were far greater in scope than Gaza, so too can Gaza if the maniacs are not in charge and the people are willing to live in peace.
As for long term peace: the Palestinians must either accept living in their own demilitarized state next to Israel, or forever be in this position of lying to it's people that one day they will overthrow Israel and living in the condition that they bring on themselves.
Sorry, but there is so much here that is absurdly and factually incorrect that I really don't have it in me to refute it point by point.
All I will say is that Gaza HAS been laid to waste. It took three months (and 22,000 dead civilians), and not "a matter of hours." So much for your "humane" military. And in what universe is it "humane" to intentionally cut off food, water, fuel, and electricity to a captive civilian population? When Russia did the very same thing in Ukraine, Secretary Blinken called it "barbarism." When Israel does it, it's "self-defense." Our collective hypocrisy really is boundless.
Israel's attack on Palestinian civilians is simply war crime and unacceptable.
Many people do not seem to understand the nature of Israel's occupation of Palestine and its oppression of Palestinians. The US, for all its claim to be a defender of freedom, is taking the wrong side of the Israel-Palestine conflict.
Sadly, Palestine is in a weak situation. As long as the US influence is dominant, nothing will change. A stronger Iran is the only foreseeable counter-balance, when Iran acquires nuclear capabilities.
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Somehow this "realist" professor does not understand on what is going on - Arab elites, Europeans and the US governments support Israel's actions and professor gets on his moral high horse to blow hot air and uses tired PC buzzwords - "innocent civilians", "ethnic cleansing", etc.
Tell me "professor" - how do you "ethnically cleanse" Gaza if its entire population is Arab?
In order to be a realist one just step out from political correctness and name things the way they are - Israel is in a tough neighborhood. The Islamist population there screams that they are not afraid of death, that they are ready to die in order to get to Allah's paradise, while "Yahuds" value life and are afraid of death. So, Israel has to show this population that the price for their aggressive behavior, support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price.
And this is the "reality" that many Arab leaders - who are better educated that their population - understand. Hopefully, this is the "reality" that European and the US governments started to understand. And that's the "reality" that this acclaimed professor just simply does not get because of his bias toward Jews.
“So, Israel has to show this population that the price for their aggressive behavior, support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price.”
How you wish Israel show this? What makes you happy and satisfied?
"...support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price. How you wish Israel show this?"
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The traditional (and undeniably correct) generally applied answer is that armed conflicts continue until one side surrenders because they have subjectively experienced sufficient death and destruction making their continued armed struggle impracticable, futile or undesirable.
In most armed conflicts the government surrenders at some point to avoid unnecessary suffering by their civilian population. If they don't surrender when they clearly can't win who owns the suffering their civilian population is continuing to experience?
Sort of like (in a wrestling match) twisting the opponent's arm (causing increasing pain) until they say "uncle". The minimum amount of force has been applied to achieve surrender. The recipient of the increasing pain is the only one in this dynamic who can decide at what point the pain sustained is not worth continuing the struggle.
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Hamas suprise attack that killed 1200 soldiers..................and civilians. That introduction tells all you need to know about this vile qatari funded propaganda channel for hamas.
So you oppose the medium that he’s on (Al-Jazeera) but have nothing substantive to say about his argument… and where do you spend your time? Which media channels do you derive your truths?
I thought that too. Al Jazeera is effectively the Qatari govt version of the BBC. This is the same Qatari govt that is harboring, wining, and dining the entire senior Hamas leadership.
I have a lot of respect for John for his stand on Ukraine, but for him to go on what amounts to Hamas TV and claim that Israel is a genocidal state damages his credibility a great deal for me.
John, please stop being an apologist for terrorism, mass rape, and child murderers.
Al Jazeera is my favourite mainstream television channel. It's not in a position to be unbiased towards its own government but has given the best coverage to the world. Their investigations, including into my own country, have been exceptional. I only recommend them and Democracy Now.
I agree Mike. Al Jezeera has great global news coverage, far better than any American news network these days and fairer, I think than the BBC. I watch NHK, France 24 and AJ. However, on this issue, their inability to be fair about their own government is precisely the problem, since that government is as much a party to this conflict as the US is.
It was wrong for Jane Fonda to appear with our enemies in Vietnam. It would have been wrong for an American journalist of professor to go on Japanese TV in 1942 and say we deserved Pearl Harbor. I also believe it's wrong for John to go on Al Jezeera and say Israel is trying to commit genocide.
When Western media is so dominant and biased, there's value in grabbing every mouthpiece. John never went on to lie, he went to tell the truth. If there had to be criticism, that kind, then cancel culture should first apply it to Fox and CNN.
Fox and CNN aren't controlled by our enemies or the enemies of our allies. Well, they are controlled by MY enemies in the sense that the Western ruling class is very much an enemy of the people at this point... but not by national enemies.
Thanks for the video. It was enlightening and provided me with additional context to work from.
I noticed a comment you made toward the end, something about ultra orthodox Jews wanting to take the land from the river to the sea. I think I found a group on Twitter (X) that would dispute what you said there.
The Torah Judaism account on X maintains that Zionism is not the same as Judaism, and Judaism does not require a state.
Dr. Mearsheimer, you would have been far more convincing had you acknowledge and analyzed how Hamas's strategy of using civilian and civilian infrastructure as cannon fodder changes the equation.
If an attacking force makes itself indistinguishable from civilians, How to proceed? (And as you know the use of civilian infrastructure for military purposes is a war crime and strips the infrastructure of protection.)
Geneva Convention, I understand. And it also strips it of protected status as civilian infrastructure. It's a way of protecting civilians. But as you may know, Hamas doesn't really care for its constituents, something that if absent an assessment, makes the assessment kind of hollow.
Which article in Geneva Convention declares use of civilian infrastructure war crime? Neither Hamas or IDF care about civilians, that's obvious for any intelligent human being
I've followed Professor Mearsheimer for many years. He's a great thinker. I have his book here on my shelf.
There is an issue with something he said in this interview though.
He's saying ultra-orthodox in Israel are going to be nearly a third of the population by 2050 because of their birth rate. And they hold certain views about the land, and presumably this is going to translate into even harder policies down the line. It's going to have an effect.
But when he's talking about American immigration, far more dramatic demographic changes that may be quite different from that in the 19th century don't seem to matter suddenly. You get the impression it will have no effect at all as everything will be pulled into this abstract American ideal I imagine.
The idea of the reverse, that this American ideal will actually get consumed by these demographic changes in time doesn't seem to be on his radar.
Instead,American will just stay America presumably no matter what. I think a lot of people would question that position.
It depends on one's definition of the "American ideal." As it is a nation of immigrants, some tend to think that continuous waves of new immigrants adding to the cultural diaspora is the very definition of the American ideal. This is a dynamic, rather than static, ideal, one that evolves and changes with time. In this view, living up to what is written on the Statue of Liberty is our nation's highest calling, in which case the recent immigration trends are something to cherish and celebrate.
This sounds like you're writing something to convince yourself, or convince others of your adoption of a set of acceptable values. It's one liberal sentimental platitude after another and it's hard to pick out anything honest and of value.
The "nation of immigrants" is incorrect, and I notice John Mearsheimer didn't quite say that, he used close, but slightly different language— that's still questionable.
America is a nation of European settlers as Huntington says. Immigration came later into what settlers had created.
What's written on the Statue of Liberty is nothing to do with what actually formed America, and it has never been America's highest calling, that's total drivel, but unfortunately it's become a kind of sentimental meme that people assert for their own political reasons. It's incorrect.
Demographics matter. JM says they matter when it comes to Israel, but seems to suggest they vanish into liberal abstractions with America. That's wrong if that's what he believes. But it's hard to believe it's what he really believes.
I'd be interested to know how you're cherishing and celebrating these recent immigration trends in real life.
The original settlers/invaders were indeed immigrants. (Even the native people originally immigrated to the Americas from Asia tens of thousands of years ago.) The "settlers" were also big time losers. They left their original homelands because they were the dregs of those societies. The whig oligarchy that established itself in the colonies came up with propaganda that was well-crafted to cause this emerging nation of losers feel like they had a higher purpose. Still, the real project was endless rape and pillage all the way to the Pacific coast, and when that ran out of steam, moving on to the rest of the world. The statue of liberty refers to late 19th century immigration waves that were motivated by the loss of slave labor, and the need for a new source of cheap labor.
Is it surprising that Emma Lazarus, descendant of Sephardic Jews, wrote the poem that turned original American promise on its head? She would have no attachment to settlers ‘dream and her main interest was in Jewish plight. Who whom, always.
Original American ideal is the nation of settlers - taming the continent, bringing civilization to savage lands. The whole narrative of immigrants and that vapid verse on the statue is recent and wrong headed addition, in my view.
Settlers? Or invaders? Who brought African slaves, consumed vast natural resources, and committed genocide on a continental scale? Is that your idea of "bringing civilization to savage lands?"
I think many would not consider this to be "ideal."
Yep, that’s how the universe works. I didn’t invent it. And please spare me the leftist guilt drivel, you’re fully enjoying the fruits of those labors. I’m typing this on iPhone while driving Alfa Romeo down 3 lane highway that did not exist 10 years ago. It’s amazing.
The question is not whether that is how the universe works. It is whether that represents an "ideal." That is the context of this thread. By definition, reality and ideal are not the same. Reality is what is, while an ideal is how we might strive to be.
Guilt is a personal matter, don't bring me into it. If you feel happy to live that way, off the exploitation of other people, and the plunder of the planet, that is your business. And what I do, or how I feel about it, is my business.
I know you won't read the comments John but i'd like to hear you sometime say what you would have done if you were in charge of Israeli policy after Oct 7. If you're admitting that these are their two choices (not sure i'd agree but ok), then it would seem you are implicitly endorsing their actions. So I think it would be useful to lay out what an ideal course of action would have been for them.
I think he grossly oversimplified things. There is a wide range of possible outcomes and I'm not optimistic but if the Palestinians were ready to make peace, Israel could pull it together and do so despite the ultra-orthdox. They'd have to be suppressed and it would be ugly but the protests over the constitutional changes provide some hope it could be done.
John, we both know the Israelis are gonna bulldoze the pals right into the sea. Get back to me when you figure out this is Putins second front meant to distract, divert, and divide.
That makes no sense. The recent Israel-Hamas situation exposes Russia's vulnerability while the Ukraine war drags out. How can Russia defend their interests in the mideast, such as in Syria, while they are bogged down in an attritional war in Ukraine? Russia is clearly not ready to fight another war, on top of Ukraine.
In fact, Russia was previously content to let the Ukraine drag on, hunkering down as Ukraine sends constant waves of futile attacks against their defensive fortifications. However, what we have seen since 7 October is a shift in Russia's stance, and an acceleration of Russian offensives meant to bring the war in Ukraine to a resolution sooner than later. So far it seems to be working, for a number of reasons.
Additionally, using proxies in such a manner is a western tactic, a business model that exploded (literally) after Vietnam rendered the US reluctant to send troops overseas. On the other hand, Russia has shown little skill in doing anything like that, although they have become increasingly skilled at countering such operations.
The impetus behind the 7 October attacks appears to come from Hamas alone. Even Hezbollah was caught off guard, perhaps they don't want to admit it, yet they were clearly not briefed by Hamas in advance. The most likely hypothesis is that Hamas only intended for this to be a hostage-grab operation, in order to force the release of Palestinian hostages held by Israel. And that operation went very badly, beginning with their landing paraglider forces in the middle of a rave that nobody knew was going to be held in that location (it had been moved from another venue, even the partygoers found out just hours before).
If there is any external influence behind Hamas, one needn't look further than Netanyahu himself, whose backing of Hamas in the past is well-documented. This war puts Biden, whom Bibi despises, into an impossible political position (damned if he does, damned if he doesn't) entering an election year. Bibi has also expressed skepticism about Ukraine, understandably sensitive to the nazi elements there, and will not shed a tear for the collapse of that regime. And finally, it has enabled IDF to destroy infrastructure in Gaza and render it uninhabitable for the foreseeable future...the Palestinians will have to leave because they cannot live there any longer.
You are not very good at "let's you and him fight" huh.
Say I'm in a knife fight with a Hispanic gentleman and along comes a fella from Nigeria and then i tell "hey! 黑！he called you a Somalian!" and then I look at the nice man from Hispaniola and say "Are you just gonna let him call you a dirty no good bundle of sticks looking for a wood pile?" And then I stand back and let you two finish each other off.
That more or less is what Putin is doing and you are either too dishonest to admit it, to unread or even unintelligent to figure it out.
Unlike CSIS CIA MI6 and Mossad not to mention DGSE and BND.
Oh, and speaking of comparing things to the Nazis, that’s the other news I wanted to mention.
What happened was, an author named Masha Gessen, who writes for The New Yorker and “is non-binary and trans and uses they/them pronouns,” was scheduled to receive this prestigious literary award in Germany. But then Masha wrote an essay in which they compared Israel’s ongoing obliteration of Gaza to the Nazis’ liquidation of the Warsaw ghetto. The Heinrich Böll Foundation was outraged, and pulled out of the ceremony, which was rescheduled, and took place yesterday.
The Woke Intelligentsia went ballistic!
Yes, that’s right, the corporate journalists, the “cultural world” (and those aspiring thereto), and the rest of the Western Culture Industry, were “shocked, shocked,” that the New Normal totalitarianism they helped usher into being for the last three years (or just looked away while it happened) had now, suddenly, turned on them!
The majority of these people spent the last two and a half years demonizing anyone who refused to follow orders and parrot the official Covid propaganda as a “Covid-denying, conspiracy theorizing, far-right-extremist anti-vax idiot,” and, well, not to put too fine a point on it, they wanted “the Unvaccinated” sent to the camps. They cheered when our “disinformation” got censored. They applauded when the police banned our protests. They celebrated when we were segregated from society. They reported us to the authorities for “not social-distancing,” “being outdoors without permission,” “improperly wearing a mask,” and so on. Basically, they behaved like textbook fascists.
And now they’re shocked and horrified that the fascist tactics they normalized are being used against them and the people they like. I’m pretty sure there is a famous quote by a German pastor that might be apposite here.
First they came for the poor, but no noticed all their data was scooped up. Then they came for the professional managerial class, but they need up on universal basic chump change income. Then they came for the semi rich, but they already were little big Eichmanns. Then they went for the rich, but they already froze their sperm and eggs and brains. Then they came for the billionaires, but they were already on Mars. Then they came for the transhumanists, but they already were cybergs. Then AI God rested on the 777th day.
What is the solution? What is the answer? How can so many people engage in meaningless blabber without a single coherent suggestions as to what a solution would look like?
https://zorkthehun.substack.com/p/the-jewish-question
That is a question. I do not have THE answer, but I do have a vision of what AN answer could look like.
How is it possible that John with all his knowledge does not?
A hint of the solution can be found here:
https://zorkthehun.substack.com/p/the-jewish-problem-and-the-final
Apartheid has been the reality for decades, and the ethnic cleansing for the past two months. Unfortunately, it will ultimately end (even more) badly for the Palestinians, since Israel will never allow a two-state outcome. And the entire world will be powerless to do anything about it as long as the United States continues its slavishly "unshakable" and morally bankrupt support.
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Is it ignorance or are you spreading misinformation? When Israel left Gaza in 2006, it imposed a blockade around it. Israel made it an open air prison. Nobody can get in and nobody can get out without permission from Israel. Even those who need to seek medical treatment in other countries like cancer patients, are more often denied. Gaza does not have an airport. Nobody can just board a plane and go anywhere. Imported items are also strictly controlled. At one point, Israel measured the amount of food that can go in that is just above starvation level. Chocolates are forbidden.
Are you kidding -- or just stupid? They imposed a blockade because Hamas is a homicidal, maniacal terror organization that kills innocent people and in its charter states that their objective is the destruction of the State of Israel and immediately made their intentions known by launching thousands of missiles at Israel. Had they wanted to turn over a new leaf and acted in a civilized, peaceful manner, Israel would have gladly taken down any blockade. BTW...it's not just Israel. Egypt has an even tighter blockade. Israel issued work permits for people living in Gaza (many of whom became spies for Hamas for the October 7 massacre). Egypt won't even do that knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood radical Islam offshoot does no good no matter where they live.
When you enslave and subjugate people and give them no hope, prepare for consequences. Never in the history of mankind where slavery did not revolt. Those Hamas terrorists who burst from the gates of their prison were in their early 20’s. They were born into the concentration camp Israel created. Even dogs, no matter how docile they were as puppies, but if you chain them, beat and abuse them everyday of their lives, they are going to be vicious.
It is Hamas that has kept its people in this situation. If they wanted to live in peace, they certainly could. They instead choose to live in a state of war. Again...think about what Gaza and its people could have been had they chosen to invest the $2 billion in making Palestine a great place to live -- with education and technology jobs, resorts on the Mediterranean, and more. Blame Hamas. Blame Hamas. Blame Hamas.
A slave or anyone a victim of an apartheid state can always choose to live in peace. But they are still a slave and oppressed. Maybe by your standard it's ok to be a slave.
Please people, educate yourselves.
Apologists for occupation love to cite the fact that Israel finally left the land it had taken by force in 1967, in violation of international law. These apologists also conveniently forget to mention that Israel still maintained total control of Gaza's land border, coastline, and airspace, in effect creating what has been called the world's largest open-air prison. Israel allowed the inmates to run their own jail.
As far as elections, the people had a stellar choice between the corrupt, bloated Palestinian Authority and Hamas. These elections, by the way, were held at the insistence of the US.
Regardless of the inept, selfish way Hamas has ruled, this has absolutely nothing to do with the substance of my previous post. This misrule does not explain the apartheid system that has existed in Israel WAY before the election of Hamas in 2006. And it has even less to do with the cutting off food, water, electricity, and fuel to a captive civilian population, and the murderous, indiscriminate bombing campaign that Israel has launched against the people of Gaza. This was my point. Not the failures of Hamas to turn Gaza into a Mediterranean resort, which would still have been impossible due to the Israeli blockade.
Israel will surely degrade Hamas' military capability, but it will never destroy Hamas. As far as this utopian future you posit where Gazans elect a new government to "live in peace," maybe you haven't noticed that Israel is systematically laying waste to the entire Gaza Strip, and has already killed 20,000 innocent civilians--not Hamas terrorists. There will be nothing left when all this is over--just an uninhabitable wasteland and two million more homeless refugees.
It took Hamas about 5 minutes to show their intentions after gaining control of Gaza (their charter to destroy Israel was already known, of course) -- when they began launching missiles at Israel. Why would Israel (or Egypt) open their borders with a homicidal terrorist organization that has already stated their intentions to murder Jews? What country in the world would ever do that? Hamas could have governed for the people, but instead operated only for themselves with their intention to kill.
As for the current operation, after the savagery that Hamas murdered, raped, and burned alive people, and the following days reiterated that this will continue again and again until they succeed in killing all Jews and destroying Israel, you're damn right that Israel is going to do everything they can to destroy them first. While I don't for a second believe the Hamas fatality numbers, I know that if Israel didn't care about civilian lives, the numbers would be dramatically higher (i.e., see nearly every other war in history).
My bet is once the war is over and Gaza demilitarized, a comprehensive plan will be proposed that will include an interim international force consisting of Egypt, Jordan, the Saudis and several other countries governing and overseeing the rebuilding of Gaza and paving the way for a two-state solution with Israel that includes normalization with the Saudis, et.al.
But, first things first: Hamas leaders and military complex must be destroyed.
"Until they succeed in killing all Jews and destroying Israel." Are you serious? Do you really think that the most powerful military in the Middle East (Israel), armed to the teeth with American weapons and a nuclear arsenal, could possibly be wiped out by Hamas? You're obviously buying into the Netanyahu lie that Hamas is an existential threat to Israel. Nothing could be more ridiculous.
And clearly Israel doesn't care about civilian lives. It has cut off food, water, electricity, and fuel to 2.3 million people. It has dropped 2,000-lb bombs on apartment buildings, schools, UN shelters, grain mills, mosques, etc.
And your "bet" that after the war is over there will be a "comprehensive plan... paving the way for a two-state solution" is firmly rooted in delusion. There will never be a Palestinian state. Gaza will be completely destroyed, and Israel will not lift a finger to rebuild it. And the West Bank is riddled with illegal Israeli settlements consisting of walled-in ghettos of impoverished Palestinians. The Israelis will never evacuate 700,000 settlers. So please tell me where this "state" will be situated.
If "the most powerful military in the Middle East" wanted to use its military might and not care about civilian casualties, all of Gaza would be laid to waste in a matter of hours. It's only because they are a humane military that they are instead as methodical as they are -- warning civilians to vacate target areas, going house by house in dangerous hand to hand combat, etc. Hamas must be eradicated to give the Palestinians a chance for peace.
As for water, there is no sign that Gazans are running out of water or food. But to take a step back, think about what Hamas has done with $2 billion of aid. Did they build desalinization plants, install drip irrigation, develep water treatment stations? No, they built terror tunnels and weapons. They took pipes that Israel had installed to deliver water and turned them into missiles.
Just as Dresden/Germany and Hiroshima and Nagasaki/Japan came back from devastating bombing campaigns that were far greater in scope than Gaza, so too can Gaza if the maniacs are not in charge and the people are willing to live in peace.
As for long term peace: the Palestinians must either accept living in their own demilitarized state next to Israel, or forever be in this position of lying to it's people that one day they will overthrow Israel and living in the condition that they bring on themselves.
Sorry, but there is so much here that is absurdly and factually incorrect that I really don't have it in me to refute it point by point.
All I will say is that Gaza HAS been laid to waste. It took three months (and 22,000 dead civilians), and not "a matter of hours." So much for your "humane" military. And in what universe is it "humane" to intentionally cut off food, water, fuel, and electricity to a captive civilian population? When Russia did the very same thing in Ukraine, Secretary Blinken called it "barbarism." When Israel does it, it's "self-defense." Our collective hypocrisy really is boundless.
You are truly ignorant of human nature if you think that after last month siege and countless deaths there will be a settled solution. Truly.
The outcome of this is another generation of Palestinian youth will only dream of becoming a martyr.
Israel's attack on Palestinian civilians is simply war crime and unacceptable.
Many people do not seem to understand the nature of Israel's occupation of Palestine and its oppression of Palestinians. The US, for all its claim to be a defender of freedom, is taking the wrong side of the Israel-Palestine conflict.
Sadly, Palestine is in a weak situation. As long as the US influence is dominant, nothing will change. A stronger Iran is the only foreseeable counter-balance, when Iran acquires nuclear capabilities.
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Somehow this "realist" professor does not understand on what is going on - Arab elites, Europeans and the US governments support Israel's actions and professor gets on his moral high horse to blow hot air and uses tired PC buzzwords - "innocent civilians", "ethnic cleansing", etc.
Tell me "professor" - how do you "ethnically cleanse" Gaza if its entire population is Arab?
In order to be a realist one just step out from political correctness and name things the way they are - Israel is in a tough neighborhood. The Islamist population there screams that they are not afraid of death, that they are ready to die in order to get to Allah's paradise, while "Yahuds" value life and are afraid of death. So, Israel has to show this population that the price for their aggressive behavior, support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price.
And this is the "reality" that many Arab leaders - who are better educated that their population - understand. Hopefully, this is the "reality" that European and the US governments started to understand. And that's the "reality" that this acclaimed professor just simply does not get because of his bias toward Jews.
“So, Israel has to show this population that the price for their aggressive behavior, support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price.”
How you wish Israel show this? What makes you happy and satisfied?
"...support for terrorism and suicidal actions have and will have high price. How you wish Israel show this?"
------
The traditional (and undeniably correct) generally applied answer is that armed conflicts continue until one side surrenders because they have subjectively experienced sufficient death and destruction making their continued armed struggle impracticable, futile or undesirable.
In most armed conflicts the government surrenders at some point to avoid unnecessary suffering by their civilian population. If they don't surrender when they clearly can't win who owns the suffering their civilian population is continuing to experience?
Sort of like (in a wrestling match) twisting the opponent's arm (causing increasing pain) until they say "uncle". The minimum amount of force has been applied to achieve surrender. The recipient of the increasing pain is the only one in this dynamic who can decide at what point the pain sustained is not worth continuing the struggle.
JOHN,
I have tremendous respect for your intelligence, honesty, and human decency. Thank you so much for showing that all is not lost in academia.
Jeremiah Gelles
Israel 100% vacated Gaza in 2005. Hamas was elected by the people and has received over $2 billion of aid. Has Hamas built up Gaza into a Singapore-like city-state on the Mediterranean with Mediterranean resorts, a great education system, first class healthcare, a desalinisation plant for water and, most importantly, to live in peace with its neighbors?
No! Hamas has governed with an iron fist. Used its aid to build a 350 mile tunnel system, built or purchased and smuggled weapons, and for 18 years has terrorized Israel. Egypt has an even tighter border knowing that this Muslim Brotherhood offshoot could enter Egypt to wreak havoc their as well.
For the sake of the Israeli and Palestinian citizens, Israel must destroy Hamas and hopefully a new government can be elected that chooses to live in peace rather than terror and war.
Not tired of copy&paste?
That’s what trolls do. They just keep repeating the same nonsense to each argument hoping it will stick.
Nope...same comment applies to each of the dolts.
If you do not kill all of your enemies they will come back and kill you.
Otherwise they are not your enemy. Sad but true.
They want that beachfront property.
https://multiracialunity.org/2023/12/19/us-imperialism-israel-palestine-whats-oil-got-to-do-with-it/
Hamas suprise attack that killed 1200 soldiers..................and civilians. That introduction tells all you need to know about this vile qatari funded propaganda channel for hamas.
And you spend your time there, professor?
So you oppose the medium that he’s on (Al-Jazeera) but have nothing substantive to say about his argument… and where do you spend your time? Which media channels do you derive your truths?
I thought that too. Al Jazeera is effectively the Qatari govt version of the BBC. This is the same Qatari govt that is harboring, wining, and dining the entire senior Hamas leadership.
I have a lot of respect for John for his stand on Ukraine, but for him to go on what amounts to Hamas TV and claim that Israel is a genocidal state damages his credibility a great deal for me.
John, please stop being an apologist for terrorism, mass rape, and child murderers.
Al Jazeera is my favourite mainstream television channel. It's not in a position to be unbiased towards its own government but has given the best coverage to the world. Their investigations, including into my own country, have been exceptional. I only recommend them and Democracy Now.
I agree Mike. Al Jezeera has great global news coverage, far better than any American news network these days and fairer, I think than the BBC. I watch NHK, France 24 and AJ. However, on this issue, their inability to be fair about their own government is precisely the problem, since that government is as much a party to this conflict as the US is.
It was wrong for Jane Fonda to appear with our enemies in Vietnam. It would have been wrong for an American journalist of professor to go on Japanese TV in 1942 and say we deserved Pearl Harbor. I also believe it's wrong for John to go on Al Jezeera and say Israel is trying to commit genocide.
When Western media is so dominant and biased, there's value in grabbing every mouthpiece. John never went on to lie, he went to tell the truth. If there had to be criticism, that kind, then cancel culture should first apply it to Fox and CNN.
Fox and CNN aren't controlled by our enemies or the enemies of our allies. Well, they are controlled by MY enemies in the sense that the Western ruling class is very much an enemy of the people at this point... but not by national enemies.
So which channels would you recommend? Which are your sources? The IDF propaganda machine?
John,
Thanks for the video. It was enlightening and provided me with additional context to work from.
I noticed a comment you made toward the end, something about ultra orthodox Jews wanting to take the land from the river to the sea. I think I found a group on Twitter (X) that would dispute what you said there.
The Torah Judaism account on X maintains that Zionism is not the same as Judaism, and Judaism does not require a state.
https://twitter.com/TorahJudaism
It's a very interesting position for a prominent group to take, and I think they're worthy of your review.
Thank you.
You can view interview with Rabbi Yaakov Shapiro on YouTube where he eloquently argues the same.
Dr. Mearsheimer, you would have been far more convincing had you acknowledge and analyzed how Hamas's strategy of using civilian and civilian infrastructure as cannon fodder changes the equation.
If an attacking force makes itself indistinguishable from civilians, How to proceed? (And as you know the use of civilian infrastructure for military purposes is a war crime and strips the infrastructure of protection.)
"civilian infrastructure for military purposes is a war crime"
Is that Rule ("Might Makes it Right") or part of Geneva Convention or another convention ?
Geneva Convention, I understand. And it also strips it of protected status as civilian infrastructure. It's a way of protecting civilians. But as you may know, Hamas doesn't really care for its constituents, something that if absent an assessment, makes the assessment kind of hollow.
Which article in Geneva Convention declares use of civilian infrastructure war crime? Neither Hamas or IDF care about civilians, that's obvious for any intelligent human being
If the IDF didn't care about civilians, you can add a zero to whatever casualty figures Hamas gives. This might help:
https://whyevolutionistrue.com/2023/11/03/the-misguided-accusations-of-genocide-against-israel-from-those-who-approve-of-genocide-against-jews/
Show me how they cared about civilians?
I've followed Professor Mearsheimer for many years. He's a great thinker. I have his book here on my shelf.
There is an issue with something he said in this interview though.
He's saying ultra-orthodox in Israel are going to be nearly a third of the population by 2050 because of their birth rate. And they hold certain views about the land, and presumably this is going to translate into even harder policies down the line. It's going to have an effect.
But when he's talking about American immigration, far more dramatic demographic changes that may be quite different from that in the 19th century don't seem to matter suddenly. You get the impression it will have no effect at all as everything will be pulled into this abstract American ideal I imagine.
The idea of the reverse, that this American ideal will actually get consumed by these demographic changes in time doesn't seem to be on his radar.
Instead,American will just stay America presumably no matter what. I think a lot of people would question that position.
It depends on one's definition of the "American ideal." As it is a nation of immigrants, some tend to think that continuous waves of new immigrants adding to the cultural diaspora is the very definition of the American ideal. This is a dynamic, rather than static, ideal, one that evolves and changes with time. In this view, living up to what is written on the Statue of Liberty is our nation's highest calling, in which case the recent immigration trends are something to cherish and celebrate.
This sounds like you're writing something to convince yourself, or convince others of your adoption of a set of acceptable values. It's one liberal sentimental platitude after another and it's hard to pick out anything honest and of value.
The "nation of immigrants" is incorrect, and I notice John Mearsheimer didn't quite say that, he used close, but slightly different language— that's still questionable.
America is a nation of European settlers as Huntington says. Immigration came later into what settlers had created.
What's written on the Statue of Liberty is nothing to do with what actually formed America, and it has never been America's highest calling, that's total drivel, but unfortunately it's become a kind of sentimental meme that people assert for their own political reasons. It's incorrect.
Demographics matter. JM says they matter when it comes to Israel, but seems to suggest they vanish into liberal abstractions with America. That's wrong if that's what he believes. But it's hard to believe it's what he really believes.
I'd be interested to know how you're cherishing and celebrating these recent immigration trends in real life.
The original settlers/invaders were indeed immigrants. (Even the native people originally immigrated to the Americas from Asia tens of thousands of years ago.) The "settlers" were also big time losers. They left their original homelands because they were the dregs of those societies. The whig oligarchy that established itself in the colonies came up with propaganda that was well-crafted to cause this emerging nation of losers feel like they had a higher purpose. Still, the real project was endless rape and pillage all the way to the Pacific coast, and when that ran out of steam, moving on to the rest of the world. The statue of liberty refers to late 19th century immigration waves that were motivated by the loss of slave labor, and the need for a new source of cheap labor.
Is it surprising that Emma Lazarus, descendant of Sephardic Jews, wrote the poem that turned original American promise on its head? She would have no attachment to settlers ‘dream and her main interest was in Jewish plight. Who whom, always.
Original American ideal is the nation of settlers - taming the continent, bringing civilization to savage lands. The whole narrative of immigrants and that vapid verse on the statue is recent and wrong headed addition, in my view.
Settlers? Or invaders? Who brought African slaves, consumed vast natural resources, and committed genocide on a continental scale? Is that your idea of "bringing civilization to savage lands?"
I think many would not consider this to be "ideal."
Yep, that’s how the universe works. I didn’t invent it. And please spare me the leftist guilt drivel, you’re fully enjoying the fruits of those labors. I’m typing this on iPhone while driving Alfa Romeo down 3 lane highway that did not exist 10 years ago. It’s amazing.
The question is not whether that is how the universe works. It is whether that represents an "ideal." That is the context of this thread. By definition, reality and ideal are not the same. Reality is what is, while an ideal is how we might strive to be.
Guilt is a personal matter, don't bring me into it. If you feel happy to live that way, off the exploitation of other people, and the plunder of the planet, that is your business. And what I do, or how I feel about it, is my business.
No, ideal is a best possible outcome in a realistic situation. Otherwise we get into unattainable set of expectations.
I know you won't read the comments John but i'd like to hear you sometime say what you would have done if you were in charge of Israeli policy after Oct 7. If you're admitting that these are their two choices (not sure i'd agree but ok), then it would seem you are implicitly endorsing their actions. So I think it would be useful to lay out what an ideal course of action would have been for them.
I think he grossly oversimplified things. There is a wide range of possible outcomes and I'm not optimistic but if the Palestinians were ready to make peace, Israel could pull it together and do so despite the ultra-orthdox. They'd have to be suppressed and it would be ugly but the protests over the constitutional changes provide some hope it could be done.
John, we both know the Israelis are gonna bulldoze the pals right into the sea. Get back to me when you figure out this is Putins second front meant to distract, divert, and divide.
You know I'm right.
That makes no sense. The recent Israel-Hamas situation exposes Russia's vulnerability while the Ukraine war drags out. How can Russia defend their interests in the mideast, such as in Syria, while they are bogged down in an attritional war in Ukraine? Russia is clearly not ready to fight another war, on top of Ukraine.
In fact, Russia was previously content to let the Ukraine drag on, hunkering down as Ukraine sends constant waves of futile attacks against their defensive fortifications. However, what we have seen since 7 October is a shift in Russia's stance, and an acceleration of Russian offensives meant to bring the war in Ukraine to a resolution sooner than later. So far it seems to be working, for a number of reasons.
Additionally, using proxies in such a manner is a western tactic, a business model that exploded (literally) after Vietnam rendered the US reluctant to send troops overseas. On the other hand, Russia has shown little skill in doing anything like that, although they have become increasingly skilled at countering such operations.
The impetus behind the 7 October attacks appears to come from Hamas alone. Even Hezbollah was caught off guard, perhaps they don't want to admit it, yet they were clearly not briefed by Hamas in advance. The most likely hypothesis is that Hamas only intended for this to be a hostage-grab operation, in order to force the release of Palestinian hostages held by Israel. And that operation went very badly, beginning with their landing paraglider forces in the middle of a rave that nobody knew was going to be held in that location (it had been moved from another venue, even the partygoers found out just hours before).
If there is any external influence behind Hamas, one needn't look further than Netanyahu himself, whose backing of Hamas in the past is well-documented. This war puts Biden, whom Bibi despises, into an impossible political position (damned if he does, damned if he doesn't) entering an election year. Bibi has also expressed skepticism about Ukraine, understandably sensitive to the nazi elements there, and will not shed a tear for the collapse of that regime. And finally, it has enabled IDF to destroy infrastructure in Gaza and render it uninhabitable for the foreseeable future...the Palestinians will have to leave because they cannot live there any longer.
You are not very good at "let's you and him fight" huh.
Say I'm in a knife fight with a Hispanic gentleman and along comes a fella from Nigeria and then i tell "hey! 黑！he called you a Somalian!" and then I look at the nice man from Hispaniola and say "Are you just gonna let him call you a dirty no good bundle of sticks looking for a wood pile?" And then I stand back and let you two finish each other off.
That more or less is what Putin is doing and you are either too dishonest to admit it, to unread or even unintelligent to figure it out.
Unlike CSIS CIA MI6 and Mossad not to mention DGSE and BND.
It's Game OVER for Putin . Poka sukhiy!
Eric’s understanding of reality and geopolitics is tenuous at best, check his other postings.
Lol yeah you are wrong.
Well, if you put it that way, I guess apartheid it is.
No, sorry. I will not follow you on Al Jazeera: enough is enough.
Please, Dr. John Mearsheimer: what is happening to you, these lasts months? Are you really you?
Stop kvetching.
Lots of 'oy veying' coming from that guy ;)
Wait till he reads Prof Mearsheimer's "The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy." It's annudda shoah.
Or watches Al Jazeera's investigation into the Israeli lobby in the UK, and the other series on the USA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceCOhdgRBoc&themeRefresh=1
CJ's latest:
Oh, and speaking of comparing things to the Nazis, that’s the other news I wanted to mention.
What happened was, an author named Masha Gessen, who writes for The New Yorker and “is non-binary and trans and uses they/them pronouns,” was scheduled to receive this prestigious literary award in Germany. But then Masha wrote an essay in which they compared Israel’s ongoing obliteration of Gaza to the Nazis’ liquidation of the Warsaw ghetto. The Heinrich Böll Foundation was outraged, and pulled out of the ceremony, which was rescheduled, and took place yesterday.
The Woke Intelligentsia went ballistic!
Yes, that’s right, the corporate journalists, the “cultural world” (and those aspiring thereto), and the rest of the Western Culture Industry, were “shocked, shocked,” that the New Normal totalitarianism they helped usher into being for the last three years (or just looked away while it happened) had now, suddenly, turned on them!
The majority of these people spent the last two and a half years demonizing anyone who refused to follow orders and parrot the official Covid propaganda as a “Covid-denying, conspiracy theorizing, far-right-extremist anti-vax idiot,” and, well, not to put too fine a point on it, they wanted “the Unvaccinated” sent to the camps. They cheered when our “disinformation” got censored. They applauded when the police banned our protests. They celebrated when we were segregated from society. They reported us to the authorities for “not social-distancing,” “being outdoors without permission,” “improperly wearing a mask,” and so on. Basically, they behaved like textbook fascists.
And now they’re shocked and horrified that the fascist tactics they normalized are being used against them and the people they like. I’m pretty sure there is a famous quote by a German pastor that might be apposite here.
https://cjhopkins.substack.com/p/seasons-greetings-from-new-normal-142
+--+
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
—Martin Niemöller
I prefer the more modern version:
First they came for the foreigners, and I did not speak out because I was not a foreigner.
Then they came for the globalists, and I did not speak out because I was not a globalist.
Then they came for the Leftists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Leftist.
Then they stopped coming for people, because most problems had disappeared.
First they came for the poor, but no noticed all their data was scooped up. Then they came for the professional managerial class, but they need up on universal basic chump change income. Then they came for the semi rich, but they already were little big Eichmanns. Then they went for the rich, but they already froze their sperm and eggs and brains. Then they came for the billionaires, but they were already on Mars. Then they came for the transhumanists, but they already were cybergs. Then AI God rested on the 777th day.
I hope you lack the power of prophecy.
I personally would have replaced "foreigners' with "Climate Change Zealots"... then I would be in full agreement with you.
I see 'CCZ' as a subset of Leftists, and a tactic of globalists.