The U.S. decided Ukraine’s fate. Ukrainians , pre-2014 U.S.-orchestrated coup, clearly wished to be militarily « neutral » state. Do a little research on Victoria Neuland and in her role in the U.S.’s plans to see Ukraine in the hands of a pro-NATO government.
The people of Ukraine didn’t have any a more a say in it than Americans have a say in U.S. military backing of Israel’s Palestinian genocide.
because meersheimer and co. say so. they want to keep the old world going as is. in this world russia gets to have an empire of the size it wants, including ukraine as its colony. why not? but strangely they do not want israel to grab palestine. (which i do not want either). but it does reek a bit of something for meersheimer and co. why can't israel have a greater israel if russia can have its empire?
i was just putting words to what you were calling giving a migraine by its very existence. so this migraine causing entity is still not throwing ciritics out of windows, i guess throwing people out of windows and shutting up in prisons doesn't give you migraines. congratulations on your strength
Also, not sure that Putin is actually as demented as the Jewish leaders. They actually pretend that God wants them to pull babies out of incubators. I don't think Putin's calculations are based in Bronze Age Jewish rules of War. The level of delusional thinking in Israel is far, far greater. We all know full well that the Jewish God is pure bullshit fiction.
Well you claim that Israel is exactly like Putin. I am just pointing out the factual inaccuracy of that claim.
If Putin is evil because he kills children, then Israel is more evil. And the U.S is funding Israel, providing it military support, selling weapons to it, and providing diplomatic cover. So the U.S is therefore more evil than Putin.
If the U.S is more evil than Putin, as measured by the amount of innocent children murdered directly or indirectly by its policies, than reducing Putin to a caricature of an evil villain is a bit simplistic.
By the way - I think the common denominator in these conflicts is U.S meddling and insistence of full-spectrum domination.
Anyway - you can tell yourself whatever you want about who is good and evil. I am curious about how you square away the cognitive dissonance.
Because Israel is only a regional hegemon and not a great world power. Great world powers influence and to some extant control it’s scope of action. Does that help?
Because Ukraine exists on the doorstep of Russia, a great world power, the same way Mexico and Canada exist on the doorstep of a great world power, the USA. Geography and circumstance can and usually do dictate geopolitical possibilities and necessities. Only a child thinks it can do anything it wants anywhere it wants….until that first smack of discipline wakes the child to the world’s reality. Great powers matter to understanding. Now do you understand? Basically, I’m saying, as an adult, you should grow up.
Russia is no longer a great world power and unfortunately that is a fact that Russians have a hard time accepting. Not that it would justify invading Ukraine. Monroe Doctrine is a relic that gets thrown around sometimes but it means next to nothing.
Russia remains a great power. Not as great as us or China but a great power nonetheless. Its geographic position in Eastern Europe and the Asian Pacific and incredible natural resources make it so. As does its historic culture. You should give it its due regard.
Yeah, they were down and out in 1991, but they've clawed themselves back to a great power status, much to the everlasting agony of the U.S. elites, who are forever stuck in the '90s when Gorby and Yeltsin did everything the U.S. told them to do because they were too weak to say no.
Mearsheimer says Russia, China and the U.S. are the world's three great powers of the moment. Some wags say Russia is a gas station masquerading as a country, but one could also say the U.S. is an open-bar-with-crappy-food-and-porn-flicks masquerading as a country.
I agree it is as great as France only it still has its empire. The sooner they give up on believing they have a special place in the world, the better as it might allow them to reform and become great again although I think it is largely over for them. Obviously, they believe otherwise and I'm o.k. with that.
I don't think the US is all that special either. It is with its allies that US becomes great. Finally, this is a bulletin board and not a written paper; I can be as wild and free with my opinions as I like.
Did you mention it was a “relic” to Fidel C in Cuba in 1962? It’s alive and well today and will remain so for as long as the USA remains a superpower, though some denizens in Cambridge, Mass., Berkeley, Ca. and Madison, Wis. might not think so. Wrongly.
Do YOU have the right to join any organization you want? For example—If you are under the age of 50, can you join the AARP? My point is that organizations have the right and the responsibility to be selective about who joins them, and NATO was careless in that regard.
And also because it would take less than ten minutes for a missile fired from Kiev to reach Moscow, eliminating any chance to stop retaliation and Armaggedon
So I read it again and I still feel the assumption is that Putin has a right to dictate what Ukraine does. I understand he doesn’t like it…. Views it as a threat.
How does he feel about the Scandinavian states that have joined NATO…… will he invade them next?
We *know* how Americans felt when the USSR out missiles in Cuba.
Folks the world is spherical. Get your hands on a globe and turn it so that Ukraine is at the centre
of the world and not your country.
Now if you were a nuclear Superpower (Russia) with a slim access to a warm water port and you had a “say” in whether opposing nuclear missiles were parked next door. You might choose to speak up. Much as I’m not a fan of Putin (or Trump or Harris), give Putin credit. He spoke up. And several times before launching his “special operation”. Here Americans and Ukrainians (and NATO sabre rattlers) look like idiots because the outcome was obvious from the start.
Oh the Chinese! Oh the Chinese! Donald Obama is not just incapable of grasping analogies, he also is. Racist towards Chinese people. Donald does Asian bashing because he's a xenophobic loser.
Just another example of the US illegally controlling populations. Same goose/gander question as the one about Mexico. Point is that the US is a shitty empire that is on the verge of collapse. NATO made Ukraine what it is today.
Okay, I think I just misunderstood your comment, and confused it with the one you were responding to. My mistake.
I thought you were equating Ukrainians with Native Americans, and arguing that Russia was acting in a way that is equivalent to the early American empire.
Obviously there are very many problems with that analogy, but the obvious one to me that I think would hopefully resonate with say, a Neo-con, is - if China is a big scary evil force (which I do not believe, but that seems to be the prevailing discourse around the Beltway) - then would you like it if it funded and trained opponents of the United States?
By the way my username is an acknowledgement of the fact that the U.S is run by a war mongering Uniparty.
No nation in the history of the world arms more conflicts or destroys more innocent lives than the USA. China is not the problem. Hating on China is bigotry, and crazily hypocritical.
Your comment, as written, is Asian -phobic, and sets a double standard in terms of sovereignty. Whether you're aping the xenophobia of the Beltway or not. I don't like that kind of blatant bigotry, obs.
I disagree - first of all - I am talking about China, which is a country. Not about a race. You are the one who interpreted my comment as racist.
Anyway - if we go by government policy - there are Asian countries that are quite antagonistic towards China and are very closely partnered with the U.S despite its crimes: Japan, the Philippines, and South Korea.
Japan and the Philippines were both brutally forced into "partnering" with the US Empire. The relations of their citizens to China cannot be summed up as "quite antagonistic" unless you're driving a WSJ bigoted narrative of hate towards the Chinese. Nation states are composed of people, btw.
What exactly is wrong from your perspective with Chinese people exercising their own sovereignty ? If you want to critique arms sales you need to start (and probably stop) with the US. Why are you dissing China if you're so woke about the war mongering uniparty?
Your comment expressed clearly the idea that China somehow shouldn't be allowed to make it's own sovereign decisions. That's straight up bigotry. Okay, maybe you're not a Racist, but the xenophobic hypocritical beltway stance against China is clearly driven by Anti-Chinese bigotry. My bad- you're right, it's bigotry, not Racism.
I don't think he will invade them. However, if things descend into nuclear war they will be direct targets. On the other hand, at that point everyone is screwed.
Main problem for those countries is now they will face pressure from NATO and their own military industrial complexes to spend more on their military, thus diverting resources from more socially beneficially initiatives.
Plus as they further militarize, Russia will respond in kind, and a tinderbox will form. War will become steadily more likely and more devastating when it does happen.
Please explain why Ukraine doesn’t have the right to join whatever organization they want.
Why does Putin get to decide the Ukrainians fate for them.
I don’t understand.
No, you don't. NAT0 is the American Empire's Foreign Legion. Members are required to buy and install advanced weapon systems aimed at Russia
Live in eastern europe and say that..
Ukraine is not wanted in NATO or Europe it is a corrupt country.
John Derbyshire has called Ukraine and Russia the two most corrupt white nations on earth.
What about the US
The U.S. decided Ukraine’s fate. Ukrainians , pre-2014 U.S.-orchestrated coup, clearly wished to be militarily « neutral » state. Do a little research on Victoria Neuland and in her role in the U.S.’s plans to see Ukraine in the hands of a pro-NATO government.
The people of Ukraine didn’t have any a more a say in it than Americans have a say in U.S. military backing of Israel’s Palestinian genocide.
because meersheimer and co. say so. they want to keep the old world going as is. in this world russia gets to have an empire of the size it wants, including ukraine as its colony. why not? but strangely they do not want israel to grab palestine. (which i do not want either). but it does reek a bit of something for meersheimer and co. why can't israel have a greater israel if russia can have its empire?
Russia does not want Ukraine ....the political system there is enough to give anyone migraine.
exxactly, the system in ukraine still has a lot of semblance to a democracy. too much for putin to handle. cannot throw everybody out of a window.
Oh dear...........semblance to democracy like the USA? Hmmmm
i was just putting words to what you were calling giving a migraine by its very existence. so this migraine causing entity is still not throwing ciritics out of windows, i guess throwing people out of windows and shutting up in prisons doesn't give you migraines. congratulations on your strength
nsakun.
I really think it's time for you to 'grow up' and learn about Ukraine.
just be careful while standing next to windows when visiting russia if you ever change your mind about putin
MSM speak............who killed the Boeing whistleblowers? Was it Russia/
Greater Israel is a demented baby slaughterer.
Also, not sure that Putin is actually as demented as the Jewish leaders. They actually pretend that God wants them to pull babies out of incubators. I don't think Putin's calculations are based in Bronze Age Jewish rules of War. The level of delusional thinking in Israel is far, far greater. We all know full well that the Jewish God is pure bullshit fiction.
just like putin, exactly like putin
Not aware of Russian forces pulling premature babies out of incubators. So, not exactly alike, huh?
You really have bought the Mainstream Media Pill.
Israel has killed more children in 10 months (and this stat is after 6 months) than 5 years of world conflict combined.
yes, of course that justifies putin's criminal war of aggression. now i understand
Well you claim that Israel is exactly like Putin. I am just pointing out the factual inaccuracy of that claim.
If Putin is evil because he kills children, then Israel is more evil. And the U.S is funding Israel, providing it military support, selling weapons to it, and providing diplomatic cover. So the U.S is therefore more evil than Putin.
If the U.S is more evil than Putin, as measured by the amount of innocent children murdered directly or indirectly by its policies, than reducing Putin to a caricature of an evil villain is a bit simplistic.
By the way - I think the common denominator in these conflicts is U.S meddling and insistence of full-spectrum domination.
Anyway - you can tell yourself whatever you want about who is good and evil. I am curious about how you square away the cognitive dissonance.
Because Israel is only a regional hegemon and not a great world power. Great world powers influence and to some extant control it’s scope of action. Does that help?
What empire? It gave that up decades ago.
Just imagine Mexico decides to install Russian nuclear missiles in Northern Mexico. Do you think the US would allow it, even if Mexico so desired?
Because Ukraine exists on the doorstep of Russia, a great world power, the same way Mexico and Canada exist on the doorstep of a great world power, the USA. Geography and circumstance can and usually do dictate geopolitical possibilities and necessities. Only a child thinks it can do anything it wants anywhere it wants….until that first smack of discipline wakes the child to the world’s reality. Great powers matter to understanding. Now do you understand? Basically, I’m saying, as an adult, you should grow up.
Russia is no longer a great world power and unfortunately that is a fact that Russians have a hard time accepting. Not that it would justify invading Ukraine. Monroe Doctrine is a relic that gets thrown around sometimes but it means next to nothing.
Russia remains a great power. Not as great as us or China but a great power nonetheless. Its geographic position in Eastern Europe and the Asian Pacific and incredible natural resources make it so. As does its historic culture. You should give it its due regard.
Yeah, they were down and out in 1991, but they've clawed themselves back to a great power status, much to the everlasting agony of the U.S. elites, who are forever stuck in the '90s when Gorby and Yeltsin did everything the U.S. told them to do because they were too weak to say no.
Mearsheimer says Russia, China and the U.S. are the world's three great powers of the moment. Some wags say Russia is a gas station masquerading as a country, but one could also say the U.S. is an open-bar-with-crappy-food-and-porn-flicks masquerading as a country.
I agree it is as great as France only it still has its empire. The sooner they give up on believing they have a special place in the world, the better as it might allow them to reform and become great again although I think it is largely over for them. Obviously, they believe otherwise and I'm o.k. with that.
I don't think the US is all that special either. It is with its allies that US becomes great. Finally, this is a bulletin board and not a written paper; I can be as wild and free with my opinions as I like.
Did you mention it was a “relic” to Fidel C in Cuba in 1962? It’s alive and well today and will remain so for as long as the USA remains a superpower, though some denizens in Cambridge, Mass., Berkeley, Ca. and Madison, Wis. might not think so. Wrongly.
Yes, it's hardly a relic--- let Mexico join BRICS and we'll see clearly how little of a relic it is.
It was just an excuse to do what they wanted to do. The reasons for Monroe doctrine have long seince passed.
Big countries get to tell small countries what to do.
Do YOU have the right to join any organization you want? For example—If you are under the age of 50, can you join the AARP? My point is that organizations have the right and the responsibility to be selective about who joins them, and NATO was careless in that regard.
And also because it would take less than ten minutes for a missile fired from Kiev to reach Moscow, eliminating any chance to stop retaliation and Armaggedon
Does this policy also apply to Cuba?
It's Russia's version of the Monroe Doctrine.
Pat I suggest you read this again?
So I read it again and I still feel the assumption is that Putin has a right to dictate what Ukraine does. I understand he doesn’t like it…. Views it as a threat.
How does he feel about the Scandinavian states that have joined NATO…… will he invade them next?
Excuse me BUT: If another country put Nukes and heavy weapons on the Mexican border......how would YOU feel?
We *know* how Americans felt when the USSR out missiles in Cuba.
Folks the world is spherical. Get your hands on a globe and turn it so that Ukraine is at the centre
of the world and not your country.
Now if you were a nuclear Superpower (Russia) with a slim access to a warm water port and you had a “say” in whether opposing nuclear missiles were parked next door. You might choose to speak up. Much as I’m not a fan of Putin (or Trump or Harris), give Putin credit. He spoke up. And several times before launching his “special operation”. Here Americans and Ukrainians (and NATO sabre rattlers) look like idiots because the outcome was obvious from the start.
If you are a weapons contractor,
Sorry I got cut off.
Weapons contractors are happy. The rest pay with blood and money and the planet suffers.
That’s absurd, based of the histories of Scandinavian states and of Ukraine.
Do we have a right to dictate what Mexico does? Goose/Gander.
Do we have a right to dictate what the Lakota and Diné do?
I don't get the analogy - did the Lakota and Dine gets years of weapons and military training from China? Did they get secret Chinese spy bases?
Fucking xenophobic bigotry from Donald, here. Seems too familiar.
Stop being anti-Asian . You're a foul hater.
Donald is scared of Asians.
Donald is a bigot when it comes to Asians.
Please stop bashing Asians you Stoopid Racist bigot.
Oh the Chinese! Oh the Chinese! Donald Obama is not just incapable of grasping analogies, he also is. Racist towards Chinese people. Donald does Asian bashing because he's a xenophobic loser.
China? Are you a Trumpito Asian bashing shit head or whut?
Just another example of the US illegally controlling populations. Same goose/gander question as the one about Mexico. Point is that the US is a shitty empire that is on the verge of collapse. NATO made Ukraine what it is today.
Okay, I think I just misunderstood your comment, and confused it with the one you were responding to. My mistake.
I thought you were equating Ukrainians with Native Americans, and arguing that Russia was acting in a way that is equivalent to the early American empire.
Obviously there are very many problems with that analogy, but the obvious one to me that I think would hopefully resonate with say, a Neo-con, is - if China is a big scary evil force (which I do not believe, but that seems to be the prevailing discourse around the Beltway) - then would you like it if it funded and trained opponents of the United States?
By the way my username is an acknowledgement of the fact that the U.S is run by a war mongering Uniparty.
No nation in the history of the world arms more conflicts or destroys more innocent lives than the USA. China is not the problem. Hating on China is bigotry, and crazily hypocritical.
Your comment, as written, is Asian -phobic, and sets a double standard in terms of sovereignty. Whether you're aping the xenophobia of the Beltway or not. I don't like that kind of blatant bigotry, obs.
By the way - the secret Chinese bases is in reference to the CIA bases that the U.S setup in Ukraine, as admitted by the NYT.
I disagree - first of all - I am talking about China, which is a country. Not about a race. You are the one who interpreted my comment as racist.
Anyway - if we go by government policy - there are Asian countries that are quite antagonistic towards China and are very closely partnered with the U.S despite its crimes: Japan, the Philippines, and South Korea.
Japan and the Philippines were both brutally forced into "partnering" with the US Empire. The relations of their citizens to China cannot be summed up as "quite antagonistic" unless you're driving a WSJ bigoted narrative of hate towards the Chinese. Nation states are composed of people, btw.
What exactly is wrong from your perspective with Chinese people exercising their own sovereignty ? If you want to critique arms sales you need to start (and probably stop) with the US. Why are you dissing China if you're so woke about the war mongering uniparty?
Your comment expressed clearly the idea that China somehow shouldn't be allowed to make it's own sovereign decisions. That's straight up bigotry. Okay, maybe you're not a Racist, but the xenophobic hypocritical beltway stance against China is clearly driven by Anti-Chinese bigotry. My bad- you're right, it's bigotry, not Racism.
NO.
I don't think he will invade them. However, if things descend into nuclear war they will be direct targets. On the other hand, at that point everyone is screwed.
Main problem for those countries is now they will face pressure from NATO and their own military industrial complexes to spend more on their military, thus diverting resources from more socially beneficially initiatives.
Plus as they further militarize, Russia will respond in kind, and a tinderbox will form. War will become steadily more likely and more devastating when it does happen.
Thanks to Joe Biden, the war mongering genocidal ass-wipe.
Read his article …
NATO is an illegal organization. A military alliance that exists outside of the UN can only be a force of tension and instability.
If you'd actually read JM's detailed article, you wouldn't have asked this question.